Michael Peña and John Michael McDonagh on corrupt cop comedy War on Everyone

Writer-director John Michael McDonagh impressed viewers with his first two features, The Guard (2011) and Calvary (2014). The latter film notably garnered acclaim as a powerful, thoughtful piece that delved into a heady intersection of morality, guilt and redemption in modern Ireland – particularly in the Catholic church. The film’s memorable tone veered between jet-black despondency and gallows humour, sometimes within the same scene.

For War on Everyone, his third film, McDonagh has left Ireland for Albuquerque, New Mexico to spin a tale about corrupt cops Bob Bolaño and Terry Monroe (Michael Peña and Alexander Skarsgård), a dissolute pair who fit up any criminal unwise enough to work their patch. Much like greedy incompetents in both the real and cinematic world, the duo run into trouble when they come up against a genuinely nasty villain. In this case, Lord James Mangan (Theo James), an especially unsavoury aristocrat.

Despite its vile, super-rich antagonist and nefarious policemen, the film is not a documentary. But it does continue in the same vein as the director’s previous work. As McDonagh says: “At first it’s a comedy, then it goes melancholy and then it gets dark and then it gets funny again. It’s the McDonagh tone.”

We met with Peña and McDonagh in separate sittings in the Soho Hotel on a late September afternoon and found both in good spirits, with London-born McDonagh on particularly amusing form having imbibed a few bottles of Japanese lager. Aside from talking about their new film, the pair discussed buddy cop pictures, what new releases have rocked their world this year, and the small matter of the US election.

Maybe I was a bit naive. Going to make an independent American film after making two films in Ireland, I thought the standard would be a lot higher.

Filmmaking, crews, stuff like that. And I was a bit surprised. Americans have a very big sense of themselves, don’t they? How important they are and ‘We make all those films all the time. Who are you coming from Europe to make a movie?’ So that was a bit annoying, that kind of attitude.

But everywhere you go in the world, and every job that you’re in, there are always people who are good at their jobs and people who aren’t. Maybe I just had an inflated sense of American cinema and what it meant.

I think budget-wise, money doesn’t go as far. On The Guard, we had six million dollars – six or seven – and we shot for 35 days. On War on Everyone, we had nine and a half million dollars, so let’s say two and a half million dollars more. I shot for 31 days so I had four days less. I was like, ‘Mmm, where’s all that money gone?’ It’s obviously much more expensive to shoot here and you’re kinda not getting the same bang for your buck. But there are certain departments which are really, really great, like the stunt department. We had a brilliant stunt driver who did every stunt on the first take which is manna from heaven for a director.

Because it’s the only laugh-out-loud movie that’s come out this year. I did laugh out loud at Deadpool though, I should be honest about that. So it’s the second laugh-out-loud film of the year.

I liked the film but I didn’t think it was laugh-out-loud funny. I love Kiss Kiss Bang Bang [which is also directed by Shane Black, like The Nice Guys] so I was expecting this to have it all the way through. But I love the two actors [Russell Crowe and Ryan Gosling] and I really got into the plot. Because we have an intricate plot too. Looking back on it now, I think to make a comedy film the plot has to be straightforward to get the laughs coming thick and fast. There is a tendency, when people are laughing, to think, ‘Have I just missed a plot point’?

If you look at the classic comedies they usually have a simple through-line. In something like Manhattan he’s having an affair and the friend’s having an affair and that’s it and it’s how they deal with those sorts of betrayals. Broadway Danny Rose he’s looking after the singer’s mistress and he has to get out of scrapes. It’s not usually a big intricate noir plotline that has lots of gags on top of it so that was an interesting discovery.

That was the only thing I could think of. The screwball comedies of the 30s and 40s did have those intricate plots, didn’t they? I’m a big fan of Preston Sturges too. You’ve got to keep up with his stuff. That’s kind of been lost now people are used to more straightforward stuff.

Politicians. I never had an interest in politicians but it’s getting really annoying because after Brexit they feel like they’re getting important again and I really hate those people.

And I don’t wanna hear about the American presidential election – I’m getting bored with that. What a great democracy: you can choose between somebody who’s corrupt and racist and somebody who’s corrupt. What a great choice. That’s where democracy has got us. Well, not us I suppose. But I don’t think we’re any different from the Americans, to be honest.

Hell or High Water. David Mackenzie’s done two good films in a row now. I really liked Starred Up as well. I was trying to make War on Everyone like a contemporary western. He’s really made his a contemporary western. I love all those shots of passing through empty towns. It’s beautifully plotted and the actors are great. I wasn’t quite sure where it was gonna end up. Usually you know if they’re gonna live or die.

Manchester by the Sea I liked. It’s about the messiness of life in a way, which I feel he’s trying to get at. I liked Green Room and Cop Car, where two kids find what they think is an abandoned cop car. And Bone Tomahawk. Talking about unpredictability, you’re not sure where it’s gonna go. That’s what I want from a film. Too often after 10 minutes I’m thinking, ‘I know how this is gonna go.’

I consider Pulp Fiction a buddy film, you know what I mean? It’s like a buddy cop film because you almost made them seem like cops. In their suits and stuff, it feels like they’re really cops except they’re like bad guys, sort of. It’s them against worse guys. I think that this film is much the same. And what’s that Coen brothers movie, Raising Arizona? It’s got Nic Cage and Holly Hunter and they’re going around, fighting the bad guys. That’s probably one of my favourite movies of all time. And he had awesome hair, Nic Cage.

Yeah, he does. He’s that guy.

I watch a lot of documentaries because I normally try to study real people and then imitate them, picking up little nuances and stuff that I wouldn’t normally do.
 
Usually in order for a documentary to be successful they always have either a great subject as a storyline or a great person, usually a charismatic person in their own right or someone very interesting.
 
I saw Everything Is Copy – Nora Ephron, that one was fantastic. Then I saw Barista [Rock Baijnauth’s documentary about a coffee competition] and that was really good and then I saw Kubo [and the Two Strings].
 
I went with my son. I really appreciate when someone makes a great animated movie for kids and adults. Because we [adults] gotta be there. We gotta be there for two hours. The themes that were touched upon were really interesting and then they showed a lot of Japanese culture, which I think is really cool. After that my son was, like,‘I really wanna go to Japan’.

I was watching it right before this [interview]. It’s so weird because he’s obviously a very charismatic speaker. Or exciting, I don’t know about charismatic. He’s exciting because you never know what he’s gonna say. And then I watched it a second time and I was like ‘Does he know what he’s talking about?’.
 
There are Republicans who haven’t endorsed a Democrat in about a hundred years and they’re now supporting Hillary Clinton. Especially after the debate, more Republicans are supporting Hillary and all the five living presidents are supporting Hillary now. They don’t want Trump in office. It isn’t that I hate the guy or anything but he does say some really crass things. I don’t know what’s gonna happen if he gets elected. I don’t know if I can stay in America. I don’t want us to get bombed.

War on Everyone was backed by the BFI Film Fund.